Joe Biden Innocent or Not Guilty

Ghengis Khan wrote:https://www.local10.com/news/local/2020/11/11/evidence-suggests-several-state-senate-candidates-were-plants-funded-by-dark-money/

They were 4 years behind-

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/criminal-justice/ct-michael-madigan-election-fraud-gonzales-appeal-arguments-20201110-un7bhbtsardfbhnjgeuqbdb4ny-story.html?outputType=amp

Ghengis Khan wrote:https://www.local10.com/news/local/2020/11/11/evidence-suggests-several-state-senate-candidates-were-plants-funded-by-dark-money/

If this is true, doesn't this make the Republicans look like they are playing dirty? The article seems to suggest that these candidates were put up for election in order to siphon votes from the Democratic candidate.

biden pick for chief of staff
wut
https://twitter.com/RonaldKlain/status/1228067999191449600

tps wrote:biden pick for chief of staff
wut
https://twitter.com/RonaldKlain/status/1228067999191449600

What a mistake, way back in Feb of 2019!  

If only there had been someone who had told the truth to the American people back then instead of holding on to that information "to keep the American people from panicking" and telling them how quickly it was going to go away.

So, if this guy listened to his President, which one is at fault?

Huck wrote:

tps wrote:biden pick for chief of staff
wut
https://twitter.com/RonaldKlain/status/1228067999191449600

What a mistake, way back in Feb of 2019!  

If only there had been someone who had told the truth to the American people back then instead of holding on to that information "to keep the American people from panicking" and telling them how quickly it was going to go away.

So, if this guy listened to his President, which one is at fault?

I'm confused. that is from Feb 13, 2020.
I'm missing your point. don't forget, dumb hick here.

1- You can drop the whole dumb hick thing with me.  I am neither city, nor suburban.
2- Oops about the date mistake.  To quote Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men, don't I feel like the f---ing a--hole.
3.  I still think Trump is a jackwagon and don't understand why people support him.

Huck wrote:

tps wrote:biden pick for chief of staff
wut
https://twitter.com/RonaldKlain/status/1228067999191449600

What a mistake, way back in Feb of 2019!  

If only there had been someone who had told the truth to the American people back then instead of holding on to that information "to keep the American people from panicking" and telling them how quickly it was going to go away.

So, if this guy listened to his President, which one is at fault?

I highly doubt this guy listened to the president. The Dems never listen to him.

dusty7 wrote:

Huck wrote:

tps wrote:biden pick for chief of staff
wut
https://twitter.com/RonaldKlain/status/1228067999191449600

What a mistake, way back in Feb of 2019!  

If only there had been someone who had told the truth to the American people back then instead of holding on to that information "to keep the American people from panicking" and telling them how quickly it was going to go away.

So, if this guy listened to his President, which one is at fault?

I highly doubt this guy listened to the president.  The Dems never listen to him.  

Listen to, or follow his advice? They certainly hang on every syllable out of his mouth.

general maximus wrote:

Teetime wrote:
Just allegations.

How do we stop the allegations?

Is that really a question from someone who identifies politically from the Left?  

We have spent the last 3.5 years and some beyond that throwing stuff at the wall and hoping it sticks.  

The modus operandi of much of the left has become "Cancel Culture"  If we cannot agree upon that, we have no hope in having a rational conversation going forward.  

Unfortunately, I think my question was rhetorical in nature..  Hell, our little red and green marks are a microcosm of that.  Admittedly my mind is very closed about some of these issues we type about, so my hypocrisy also exists.  But, I want to be able to defend my position on said issues, because if I cannot defend that position, then I need to evaluate if that should be my position.  

Yes. Really a question from the left.

How do we stop the allegations? They are really just more in the string of lies the President has used to win the hearts and minds of those who don’t mind being lied to.

So, how do we stop the lies?

As for the last 3.5 years...I’m proud of having pointed out lies as often as I had time to respond and sorry that I couldn’t afford to have done it more often.

Your question might have been rhetorical, but I feel proud to have an answer and proud to not have believed the lies.

The Director of Homeland Security said that he thinks the November 3 Election was the most secure in history. He's about to get fired.

Teetime wrote:

general maximus wrote:

Teetime wrote:
Just allegations.

How do we stop the allegations?

Is that really a question from someone who identifies politically from the Left?  

We have spent the last 3.5 years and some beyond that throwing stuff at the wall and hoping it sticks.  

The modus operandi of much of the left has become "Cancel Culture"  If we cannot agree upon that, we have no hope in having a rational conversation going forward.  

Unfortunately, I think my question was rhetorical in nature..  Hell, our little red and green marks are a microcosm of that.  Admittedly my mind is very closed about some of these issues we type about, so my hypocrisy also exists.  But, I want to be able to defend my position on said issues, because if I cannot defend that position, then I need to evaluate if that should be my position.  

Yes. Really a question from the left.

How do we stop the allegations? They are really just more in the string of lies the President has used to win the hearts and minds of those who don’t mind being lied to.

So, how do we stop the lies?

As for the last 3.5 years...I’m proud of having pointed out lies as often as I had time to respond and sorry that I couldn’t afford to have done it more often.

Your question might have been rhetorical, but I feel proud to have an answer and proud to not have believed the lies.

Why do people treat Trump like he's the only president that has ever lied? Reagan and Iran Contra, Clinton and Lewinsky, Bush and Iraq, and many others.

Blame Trump all you want but don't act like he's the the only problem in DC, there are 535 problems in DC.

I think Ive been clear on this, anyone who believes and trusts that the federal government has your or even society's best interests in mind needs to do some serious fact checking. They are in it for the money and the kickbacks from the lobbyists and the preferential treatment they get for being in a position of power. They will lie and change their opinions all for the mighty $$.

Huck wrote:1- You can drop the whole dumb hick thing with me.  I am neither city, nor suburban.
2- Oops about the date mistake.  To quote Jack Nicholson in A Few Good Men, don't I feel like the f---ing a--hole.
3.  I still think Trump is a jackwagon and don't understand why people support him.

honest mistake (date)
for me, i support trump because of his policies (jobs, low unemployment, illegal immigration, etc). also in politics, he's an underdog, a political outsider. he was mocked and laughed at when he announced his campaign. (obama mic drop). After that, his campaign was illegally spied on by the FBI and CIA orchestrated by the dems.  DC insiders are the scum of the scum. The impeachment BS started almost immediately. https://www.needtoimpeach.com/  DC scum lied about evidence they didn't have. also daily media attacks, fake news attacks. He's said/done some bad things but he's definitely not a DC insider. He was also nominated 3 times for a nobel peace prize. my opinion, let the attacks from the left begin.

The Lincoln Project- that plucky little group of "Republicans" who just wanted to get rid of Trump to protect democracy- is currently raising funds for the Democrat Senate efforts in Georgia.

That seems a little off their goals.

Head Idiot wrote:The Lincoln Project- that plucky little group of "Republicans" who just wanted to get rid of Trump to protect democracy- is currently raising funds for the Democrat Senate efforts in Georgia.

That seems a little off their goals.

Nope.

Their goal was to get rid of Trumpism. That included a vanquishing of the enablers. They were less than successful, but beating Republican Senators was one of the goals.

dusty7 wrote:Why do people treat Trump like he's the only president that has ever lied? Reagan and Iran Contra, Clinton and Lewinsky, Bush and Iraq, and many others.  

I don't treat him that way. I know I have been lied to by Presidents of all stripes. I would have told you Bill Clinton was the biggest liar ever to hold that office (before Trump) and I have said so right here at Turk's Place.

There is a huge difference between the lies told by Clinton/Trump and the other famous lies you have cited.

Trump and Clinton lied for their own personal benefit or to avoid personal punishment, the others (and here you should also include Obama and Obamacare) were not looking out for themselves as much as they were motivated by what they thought was best for the country as a whole.

Trump can barely complete a sentence without lying. Certainly I have never heard him speak for longer that three minutes without at least one lie and usually it involves something that is easily disproved. We became numb to the lying. BW likes to treat it like his shtick..."get over it, it's just his way of storytelling". I just can't bring myself to accept the way he treats the truth. I think part of it is brainwashing. He thinks if he tells a lie often enough it becomes the truth and many of his fans have come to accept as truth his often told lies. I watch one of his rallies and I'm honestly entertained, I see why people crowd in to see them. He is a good entertainer without ever telling a joke or singing a song or doing a dance...just lie after lie.

I'd agree with a lot of what Tee said and also include the election seems to be the epitome of what Trump does...he claims election fraud but yet his own party held onto the Senate, gained seats in the House, and the states he says he was the victim of voting fraud in have a great number of Republicans in some sort of control over the elections themselves. His followers will continue to back up the same message...why? Because he says it loud enough and happens to be the guy at the microphone...for the time being.

As of this evening it looks like a 306-232 electoral edge for Biden and he leads in the popular vote by around 5.3 million. That's a solid win for old Joe.

Teetime wrote:

dusty7 wrote:Why do people treat Trump like he's the only president that has ever lied? Reagan and Iran Contra, Clinton and Lewinsky, Bush and Iraq, and many others.  

I don't treat him that way. I know I have been lied to by Presidents of all stripes. I would have told you Bill Clinton was the biggest liar ever to hold that office (before Trump) and I have said so right here at Turk's Place.

There is a huge difference between the lies told by Clinton/Trump and the other famous lies you have cited.

Trump and Clinton lied for their own personal benefit or to avoid personal punishment, the others (and here you should also include Obama and Obamacare) were not looking out for themselves as much as they were motivated by what they thought was best for the country as a whole.

Trump can barely complete a sentence without lying. Certainly I have never heard him speak for longer that three minutes without at least one lie and usually it involves something that is easily disproved. We became numb to the lying. BW likes to treat it like his shtick..."get over it, it's just his way of storytelling". I just can't bring myself to accept the way he treats the truth. I think part of it is brainwashing. He thinks if he tells a lie often enough it becomes the truth and many of his fans have come to accept as truth his often told lies. I watch one of his rallies and I'm honestly entertained, I see why people crowd in to see them. He is a good entertainer without ever telling a joke or singing a song or doing a dance...just lie after lie.

Both Bush's lied about Iraq to further their personal (and Dick Cheney's) oil and wealth interests in the Middle East. Ronald Reagan meddled with American hostages in Iran to get elected. Lyndon Johnson flat made a story up about the Gulf of Tonkin to get Americans emotionally invested in a military build up in Vietnam. We all know what Nixon did. Kennedy and Cuba. Those are not small lies.

In fact, about the only president to not have a major scandal, dishonesty to the American people is probably one of the worst presidents we've had- Jimmy Carter.

Head Idiot wrote:

In fact, about the only president to not have a major scandal, dishonesty to the American people is probably one of the worst presidents we've had- Jimmy Carter.

But interestingly, Carter is probably the greatest ex-POTUS.

19delta wrote:

Head Idiot wrote:

In fact, about the only president to not have a major scandal, dishonesty to the American people is probably one of the worst presidents we've had- Jimmy Carter.

But interestingly, Carter is probably the greatest ex-POTUS.

Agreed. He certainly has done the most post office. Completely oppose his politics, but he is a great human being.

OSUBucks wrote:The Director of Homeland Security said that he thinks the November 3 Election was the most secure in history. He's about to get fired.

I can also see that coming.

However, just because it was more secure than the others, does not mean it is secure to the level it should be. Meaning it could be rift with fraud instead of being plagued.

Remember being better than last election does not mean it was good. Just ask VOX. Here is the article.

https://www.vox.com/2014/7/14/5898365/68-of-americans-think-elections-are-rigged

And then how about the tweet right after that by Ron Klain. His response to the claim that 68% of Americans think elections are rigged was " That's because they are."

Vox didn’t exactly dive into the validity of elections in the USA.

They read the results of a poll put out by a different news organization on how Americans “feel” about elections.

Nobody knows anything. We feel something and that becomes a story.

Teetime wrote:Vox didn’t exactly dive into the validity of elections in the USA. But they certainly insinuated that to their readers

They read the results of a poll put out by a different news organization on how Americans “feel” about elections. So are those feelings wrong now, or were they wrong back when he said it?

Nobody knows anything. If Klain doesn't know anything, why would Joe employ him? We feel something and that becomes a story. Welcome to nearly every media strategy currently

I saw a meme that resonated some. It read something like "The last 4 years most Democrats said how susceptible our elections were to fixing/interference/fraud by Russia and that is the only way Trump won. Now our elections are impervious to any forms of fraud."

Hyperbole, but still speaks to the hypocrisy of BOTH sides. I guess that is where I feel so disenfranchised. Many on the left seem very resistant to admit that both parties are crooks in so many ways.

general maximus wrote:

Teetime wrote:Vox didn’t exactly dive into the validity of elections in the USA.  But they certainly insinuated that to their readers

They read the results of a poll put out by a different news organization on how Americans “feel” about elections. So are those feelings wrong now, or were they wrong back when he said it?

Nobody knows anything. If Klain doesn't know anything, why would Joe employ him? We feel something and that becomes a story.  Welcome to nearly every media strategy currently

I saw a meme that resonated some.  It read something like "The last 4 years most Democrats said how susceptible our elections were to fixing/interference/fraud by Russia and that is the only way Trump won.  Now our elections are impervious to any forms of fraud."

Hyperbole, but still speaks to the hypocrisy of BOTH sides.  I guess that is where I feel so disenfranchised.  Many on the left seem very resistant to admit that both parties are crooks in so many ways.  

There was Russian interference in the 2016 election. They interfered in this election as well. It's a GIVEN.

The last 4 years, the Dems were bemoaning the fact that they lost the popular vote, again, and the President was elected by the electoral college instead of by the candidate with the most votes.

In our Presidential elections and in the response to the pandemic, the flaws of our constitutional republic become very apparent.