Another big small-school game!

This week, 6-0 Lena-Winslow will host 5-1 Du-Pec in a game that will determine the NUIC champions. During the 2021 spring season Du-Pec dominated Lena-Winslow for 3 quarters and was cruising to a 21-11 victory before Lena-Winslow turned the game around with two 4th quarter TDs and an eventual 24-21 victory with just seconds left in the game.

Lena-Winslow is currently the #1 ranked team in 1a. They are coming off an impressive 38-27 win against DePaul Prep, a school with more than 700 students. Du-Pec's only loss this season is to St. Teresa, the #1 ranked team in 2a. In Week 5, Du-Pec played St. Teresa tough but lost 28-22. Prior to the 22 points scored by Du-Pec, St. Teresa had only surrendered 15 points all season.

Sounds like a real good matchup.

19delta wrote:Lena-Winslow is currently the #1 ranked team in 1a. They are coming off an impressive 38-27 win against DePaul Prep, a school with more than 700 students.

Was the 11 point win impressive because of DePaul's size?  Clearly, it couldn't be because of their 2-4 record, which includes a loss to 320 student Leo HS (also 2-4) by 14 a couple of weeks before.

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:Lena-Winslow is currently the #1 ranked team in 1a. They are coming off an impressive 38-27 win against DePaul Prep, a school with more than 700 students.

Was the 11 point win impressive because of DePaul's size?  Clearly, it couldn't be because of their 2-4 record, which includes a loss to 320 student Leo HS (also 2-4) by 14 a couple of weeks before.

In some cases, I think the enrollment differences between schools is a moot point.  I am sure there are many 1A schools in any given year who could hang with some 4A or 5A schools.  In 2019 we (enrollment 440) played Oak Lawn (enrollment 1900) and we won 58-28 and the game wasn't even that close.

Don't get me wrong, playing bigger schools is a challenge for small schools but sometimes the small School have more talent than the large schools.

I would take many LW teams and put them against solid 3A/4A programs and I think LW would win most games. They are that good of a program. Same with MF and some of the Tuscola teams from the past.

dusty7 wrote:

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:Lena-Winslow is currently the #1 ranked team in 1a. They are coming off an impressive 38-27 win against DePaul Prep, a school with more than 700 students.

Was the 11 point win impressive because of DePaul's size?  Clearly, it couldn't be because of their 2-4 record, which includes a loss to 320 student Leo HS (also 2-4) by 14 a couple of weeks before.

In some cases, I think the enrollment differences between schools is a moot point.  I am sure there are many 1A schools in any given year who could hang with some 4A or 5A schools.  In 2019 we (enrollment 440) played Oak Lawn (enrollment 1900) and we won 58-28 and the game wasn't even that close.

Don't get me wrong, playing bigger schools is a challenge for small schools but sometimes the small School have more talent than the large schools.

I would take many LW teams and put them against solid 3A/4A programs and I think LW would win most games.  They are that good of a program.  Same with MF and some of the Tuscola teams from the past.

I'd pick Le-Win over Waukegan, its 4,562 students, and its 51-man roster (14 of whom are in grades 9 and 10).

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:Lena-Winslow is currently the #1 ranked team in 1a. They are coming off an impressive 38-27 win against DePaul Prep, a school with more than 700 students.

Was the 11 point win impressive because of DePaul's size?  Clearly, it couldn't be because of their 2-4 record, which includes a loss to 320 student Leo HS (also 2-4) by 14 a couple of weeks before.

Yes. And the 40 juniors and seniors they have on the varsity team.

There aren't many high schools that can so decisively beat a high school with 3x the student population. Lena-Winslow is special.

19delta wrote:There aren't many high schools that can so decisively beat a high school with 3x the student population.

Not trying to take anything away from L-W, but we are talking about an 11 point game.  My issue is with you calling it an impressive win in which DePaul was decisively beaten.  A missed 23 yard FGA by DePaul early in the 4th and a missed PAT with 4 minutes left in the game would have made it a 7 point game at the end if those chip shots had been made and everything else remained the same.

Again, DePaul is 2-4 so far after going 2-4 last spring.  They are a team that got beat by 14 three weekends ago by a school of 160 boys and a current record of 2-4.  Please, let's not pretend they are something they're not, and let's not pretend L-W's win was decisive.  I will say this about DePaul, though:  They are young and on the right track.  They will be much, much better in the next couple of years.

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:There aren't many high schools that can so decisively beat a high school with 3x the student population.

Not trying to take anything away from L-W, but we are talking about an 11 point game.  My issue is with you calling it an impressive win in which DePaul was decisively beaten.  A missed 23 yard FGA by DePaul early in the 4th and a missed PAT with 4 minutes left in the game would have made it a 7 point game at the end if those chip shots had been made and everything else remained the same.

Again, DePaul is 2-4 so far after going 2-4 last spring.  They are a team that got beat by 14 three weekends ago by a school of 160 boys and a current record of 2-4.  Please, let's not pretend they are something they're not, and let's not pretend L-W's win was decisive.  I will say this about DePaul, though:  They are young and on the right track.  They will be much, much better in the next couple of years.

DePaul scored a couple TDs in garbage time after Lena had put backups in. There was never a moment in which DePaul was within a mile of competing. Lena completely controlled the game.

19delta wrote:

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:There aren't many high schools that can so decisively beat a high school with 3x the student population.

Not trying to take anything away from L-W, but we are talking about an 11 point game.  My issue is with you calling it an impressive win in which DePaul was decisively beaten.  A missed 23 yard FGA by DePaul early in the 4th and a missed PAT with 4 minutes left in the game would have made it a 7 point game at the end if those chip shots had been made and everything else remained the same.

Again, DePaul is 2-4 so far after going 2-4 last spring.  They are a team that got beat by 14 three weekends ago by a school of 160 boys and a current record of 2-4.  Please, let's not pretend they are something they're not, and let's not pretend L-W's win was decisive.  I will say this about DePaul, though:  They are young and on the right track.  They will be much, much better in the next couple of years.

DePaul scored a couple TDs in garbage time after Lena had put backups in. There was never a moment in which DePaul was within a mile of competing. Lena completely controlled the game.

Since when is garbage time early in the third quarter with your team up by two scores on the road?  What game did you watch?  Here is a link to the one I watched:    

Here is how the scoring went in the game that I watched.  

LW scored twice in the first quarter to go up 16-0 at the :58 mark.  DePaul got on the board at 10:51 of Q2 to make it a 16-7 game.  LW then scored two more unanswered TDs to go up 30-7 with 1:56 left in the first half. DePaul responded with two unanswered TDs (one late in the 2nd quarter and one early in the 3rd) to make it a 30-21 ballgame at the 10:39 mark in the third quarter.  LW scored with 1:40 left in Q3 to go up by 16 pts 38-21.  DePaul scored the final TD of the game at the 4:01 mark of Q4 to make the final score 38-27.

Sorry, but I don't see the game as you did.  I'd love to see the yardage and other stats of the game.  IMO, it was far from a decisive or impressive win.  I'm not saying that LW narrowly won.  What I am saying is that, while not a nail biter kind of game in terms of final score, each team made some good runs.  You say tomayto and claim that it was an impressive and decisive win.  I say tomahto and factually state that DePaul outscored LW 27-22 in the last three quarters of the game.

Good win for L-W against a larger and more battle tested school than most of their opponents.
Anything beyond that …. Shhh

Doctor D wrote:Good win for L-W against a larger and more battle tested school than most of their opponents.  
Anything beyond that …. Shhh

Completely agree that it was a nice win for L-W.

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:There aren't many high schools that can so decisively beat a high school with 3x the student population.

Not trying to take anything away from L-W, but we are talking about an 11 point game.  My issue is with you calling it an impressive win in which DePaul was decisively beaten.  A missed 23 yard FGA by DePaul early in the 4th and a missed PAT with 4 minutes left in the game would have made it a 7 point game at the end if those chip shots had been made and everything else remained the same.

Again, DePaul is 2-4 so far after going 2-4 last spring.  They are a team that got beat by 14 three weekends ago by a school of 160 boys and a current record of 2-4.  Please, let's not pretend they are something they're not, and let's not pretend L-W's win was decisive.  I will say this about DePaul, though:  They are young and on the right track.  They will be much, much better in the next couple of years.

DePaul scored a couple TDs in garbage time after Lena had put backups in. There was never a moment in which DePaul was within a mile of competing. Lena completely controlled the game.

Since when is garbage time early in the third quarter with your team up by two scores on the road?  What game did you watch?  Here is a link to the one I watched:    

Here is how the scoring went in the game that I watched.  

LW scored twice in the first quarter to go up 16-0 at the :58 mark.  DePaul got on the board at 10:51 of Q2 to make it a 16-7 game.  LW then scored two more unanswered TDs to go up 30-7 with 1:56 left in the first half.  DePaul responded with two unanswered TDs (one late in the 2nd quarter and one early in the 3rd) to make it a 30-21 ballgame at the 10:39 mark in the third quarter.  LW scored with 1:40 left in Q3 to go up by 16 pts 38-21.  DePaul scored the final TD of the game at the 4:01 mark of Q4 to make the final score 38-27.

Sorry, but I don't see the game as you did.  I'd love to see the yardage and other stats of the game.  IMO, it was far from a decisive or impressive win.  I'm not saying that LW narrowly won.  What I am saying is that, while not a nail biter kind of game in terms of final score, each team made some good runs.  You say tomayto and claim that it was an impressive and decisive win.  I say tomahto and factually state that DePaul outscored LW 27-22 in the last three quarters of the game.

As I said, there was never a moment in which the game was in doubt. At no time was DePaul within 1 score of LW. LW led comfortably the entire game.

And again...for a school with a third the enrollment of DePaul's that is an impressive win.

How many schools of Lena's size could comfortably defeat a school like DePaul with their enrollment and resources? I saw pictures of their facilities. Impressive, to say the least. And they dressed well around 60 kids for the varsity game.

I guess 1 LW player is worth 3 DePaul Prep players. Maybe a reverse multiplier?

19delta wrote:At no time was DePaul within 1 score of LW.

Um, no.  The score was tied at zero or it was a one score game for all but the last minute of the first quarter.  

I concede that L-W won the first quarter.  I'd even say that they decisively won the first quarter.  From then on, though, it was 27-22 DePaul.

19delta wrote:LW led comfortably the entire game.

So I guess ties and a one score lead for 11 minutes are comfortable leads in your world.  Interesting.

19delta wrote:And again...for a school with a third the enrollment of DePaul's that is an impressive win.

If L-W had won in a squeaker, it sounds like it would have been an impressive win from your perspective for no other reason than the size differential.  God knows it can't be because of DePaul's 2-4 record.  

Again, enrollment isn't always the end all and be all.  I'd pick L-W over Waukegan and their 4500 students.  And another thing about enrollment...DePaul's actual enrollment on the IHSA website is 518, making L-W's IHSA enrollment roughly half that of DePaul Prep.  I realize that the school says they have 720 or so students, so I have to believe that the IHSA website is using old numbers.  The truth of the matter is that DePaul has experienced substantial enrollment growth since they moved into their new campus from their old one a couple of years ago.  That growth is almost entirely represented in much larger 9th and 10th grade classes than the upper classes.  That is another reason why I say that DePaul will be a much better team in a couple of years.  

19delta wrote:How many schools of Lena's size could comfortably defeat a school like DePaul with their enrollment and resources?

Well, we saw 2-4 Leo H.S. and their 160 boys beat DePaul even more decisively just three weekends ago.  In week one, Casey Westfield (enrollment 258) beat Olney Richland County (enrollment 735) by 9 points. Does 9 points qualify as comfortable? Just askin'.  See me for an update after week nine when Chester (currently 5-1) and its 350 enrollment plays Mt. Vernon (currently 0-6) and their 1150 kids.  

But, hey, at least you have gone from decisive win to comfortable.  That's progress.

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:At no time was DePaul within 1 score of LW.

Um, no.  The score was tied at zero or it was a one score game for all but the last minute of the first quarter.  

I concede that L-W won the first quarter.  I'd even say that they decisively won the first quarter.  From then on, though, it was 27-22 DePaul.

19delta wrote:LW led comfortably the entire game.

So I guess ties and a one score lead for 11 minutes are comfortable leads in your world.  Interesting.

19delta wrote:And again...for a school with a third the enrollment of DePaul's that is an impressive win.

If L-W had won in a squeaker, it sounds like it would have been an impressive win from your perspective for no other reason than the size differential.  God knows it can't be because of DePaul's 2-4 record.  

Again, enrollment isn't always the end all and be all.  I'd pick L-W over Waukegan and their 4500 students.  And another thing about enrollment...DePaul's actual enrollment on the IHSA website is 518, making L-W's IHSA enrollment roughly half that of DePaul Prep.  I realize that the school says they have 720 or so students, so I have to believe that the IHSA website is using old numbers.  The truth of the matter is that DePaul has experienced substantial enrollment growth since they moved into their new campus from their old one a couple of years ago.  That growth is almost entirely represented in much larger 9th and 10th grade classes than the upper classes.  That is another reason why I say that DePaul will be a much better team in a couple of years.  

19delta wrote:How many schools of Lena's size could comfortably defeat a school like DePaul with their enrollment and resources?

Well, we saw 2-4 Leo H.S. and their 160 boys beat DePaul even more decisively just three weekends ago.  In week one, Casey Westfield (enrollment 258) beat Olney Richland County (enrollment 735) by 9 points.  Does 9 points qualify as comfortable?  Just askin'.   See me for an update after week nine when Chester (currently 5-1) and its 350 enrollment plays Mt. Vernon (currently 0-6) and their 1150 kids.  

But, hey, at least you have gone from decisive win to comfortable.  That's progress.

After LW took the lead 16-0, DePaul never came within 1 score. So after building a 30-7 lead, LW probably took their foot off the gas. But, the game was over. LW did what they needed and were able to coast the rest of the game. DePaul never seriously threatened LW's chance of winning after that point.

I'm not aware of "winning the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th quarter" as an official statistic. Is that on the IHSA website somewhere?

I would also be interested in finding out how many 2-way starters DePaul had compared to LW. I'm sure DePaul had fewer so yes...if the game was extended to 6-8 quarters, DePaul might have eventually worn LW down enough to take the lead. But, they don't get 6-8 quarters. They only get 4. And that's all LW needed to put away a school with 3x the enrollment.

19delta wrote:DePaul might have eventually worn LW down enough to take the lead. But, they don't get 6-8 quarters. They only get 4. And that's all LW needed to put away a school with 3x the enrollment.

I get that it's a big deal for the smaller school when a school the size of LW gets to play a substantially larger school...especially when it rarely, if ever, happens under normal circumstances.  Maybe if it happened more than once in a blue moon, it wouldn't be as big of a deal.  David beating Goliath is always a crowd pleaser for the David fans.  It was a nice win for them.  Kudos for them for making the trip and playing a bigger school.

ramblinman wrote:

19delta wrote:DePaul might have eventually worn LW down enough to take the lead. But, they don't get 6-8 quarters. They only get 4. And that's all LW needed to put away a school with 3x the enrollment.

I get that it's a big deal for the smaller school when a school the size of LW gets to play a substantially larger school...especially when it rarely, if ever, happens under normal circumstances.  Maybe if it happened more than once in a blue moon, it wouldn't be as big of a deal.  David beating Goliath is always a crowd pleaser for the David fans.  It was a nice win for them.  Kudos for them for making the trip and playing a bigger school.

Agreed.

Du-Pec up 14-0 early 2nd qt. LW doesn't have a 1st down yet.

Du-Pec dominating.

22-0.

LW with more penalty yards than offense

LW with a crazy TD right at the end of the half. LW QB threw an INT but LW receiver took ball away from Du-Pec defender and ran to endzone. 2-pt play good.

Du-Pec - 22
LW - 8

Momentum shifting towards LW

End of 3rd qt.

Du-Pec - 22
LW - 16

LW driving!

Let’s go!

LW scores a long TD on a 4th and 8 and converts the 2-pt play!

LW - 24
Du-Pec - 22

Early 4th qt

Du-Pec regains the lead. 30-22 just under 6 minutes left in the game.

Du-Pec up 30-22. About 2 minutes left. Du-Pec looking to run out the clock.

Might want to mobilize The Illinois National Guard and send them north. Western Winnebago County is going to be rockin' tonight if Du-Pec closes the game out!

LW going to get the ball back with 1 minute left and no timeouts.