Government Shutdown

I ask this in all seriousness without trying to start anything- The government has been "shut down" for 25 days now. Has anyone noticed any difference in your day to day lives?

yes. we had 14" of snow.

Nothing at all.

I live, quite literally, in the middle of a National Park. Last shutdown the Superintendent put up some construction barricades, which were promptly knocked over (by my wife).

Now, people have been riding horses and bikes, as usual, and hiking. The only difference to most people is the Visitor Center is closed. Hikers, horsebackers and hikers here usually pack out their trash, so no build up that I've seen....

P.S. I've only seen ONE ranger on horse back in ten years of riding this park. The only time I see rangers is when I volunteer for trail clearing duty... and they're not really "rangers" clearing trail, they're seasonal maintenance guys.

BirdWatcher wrote:I live, quite literally, in the middle of a National Park.  Last shutdown the Superintendent put up some construction barricades, which were promptly knocked over (by my wife).  

bad brenda!

My work requires that I correspond fairly frequently with the IRS. That has come to a standstill.

Head Idiot wrote:I ask this in all seriousness without trying to start anything- The government has been "shut down" for 25 days now.  Has anyone noticed any difference in your day to day lives?

None personally, but I would hate to operate a lunch place or a food truck that caters to government employees.

If anyone thinks the shutdown impact is negligible in the grand scheme of things, they are mistaken.

ripple effect

ripple effect

If you can lay off 25% of the federal government and people's lives (those outside having those jobs) can exist pretty much uninterrupted, why do those jobs exist?

Not meant to start a riot- more a rhetorical question.

I read somewhere that the typical federal EMPLOYEE makes 1.8x what a typical US FAMILY makes. Does that pass the sniff test? The few federal employees I know (Park Service) make alot compared to what the locals make around here.....

Head Idiot wrote:If you can lay off 25% of the federal government and people's lives (those outside having those jobs) can exist pretty much uninterrupted, why do those jobs exist?

Not meant to start a riot- more a rhetorical question.

The shutdown began on Saturday, 12/22. Since then, there have been basically 17 working days.

I think there's a distinction to be drawn between a temporary furlough and a permanent lay off. If those 25% were permanently laid off, and their jobs were simply not being done by anyone anymore, I think you would see the impact of that before too much more time passes.

ramblinman wrote:

Head Idiot wrote:If you can lay off 25% of the federal government and people's lives (those outside having those jobs) can exist pretty much uninterrupted, why do those jobs exist?

Not meant to start a riot- more a rhetorical question.

The shutdown began on Saturday, 12/22.  Since then, there have been basically 17 working days.  

I think there's a distinction to be drawn between a temporary furlough and a permanent lay off.  If those 25% were permanently laid off, and their jobs were simply not being done by anyone anymore, I think you would see the impact of that before too much more time passes.

IIRC the majority of them are IRS employees. I'd be fine with those people never working again.

You usually get one of two responses when asking about the shutdown in my neck of the woods:

1) Shutdown? What shutdown?
2) Why is it only a 'partial' shutdown? Shut it ALL down....

An agreement has been reached and the shutdown is over.
Today was probably the worst day the Trump administration has had to date. The agreement contains no money for the wall. If that wasn't enough longtime Trump advisor Roger Stone was indicted on 7 counts today, including lying to congress and witness tampering. I don't expect that the Russian investigation is going away any time soon and I think that there are more indictments coming.

Meh, today was American politics at its finest. No one won, both sides will claim victory, nothing was solved and we just delayed the inevitable.

It's really getting revolting at this point.

No one won?

You’re kidding right?

Teetime wrote:No one won?

You’re kidding right?

How is it a win? 3 weeks from now we'll be doing exactly the same thing.

Nothing was solved. Only in America would delaying a problem with no solution in sight be considered a win.

Three weeks from now the President will be licking his wounds still.

Nancy sat on his face right in front of everyone. The solution has been found. It just took the President a while to realize that he didn’t have the votes to win this fight.

Just like when Clinton found out there was no support for Hillarycare and W found out there weren’t the votes to privatize social security, this President found out that the wall Mexico was paying for was a big hit at his rallies, the one we had to pay for was a flop.

If he declares an emergency, he builds the wall and nothing changed on either side. Nancy can have Schumer flick the bean all she wants to tonight because she "won", but in two days Trump could jerk it all he wants because he "won" and nothing changes.

That Emergency option will be tied up in courts until the next president is elected in 2020

And another 2 million illegal immigrants will have crossed into the country by then and literally nothing will be passed legislatively in the country for the next 2 years. Winning, Pelosi style!

In Civics class we talk about the difference between governing and politics. Politics is the process of getting elected and gaining power. Governing is actually doing something once in power. Neither side has governed in about a decade, if not more. But, if getting a chubby over resisting gets you going, feel free to flick Nancy's bean as much as you like over this giant "win".

Head Idiot wrote:And another 2 million illegal immigrants will have crossed into the country by then and literally nothing will be passed legislatively in the country for the next 2 years.  Winning, Pelosi style!

In Civics class we talk about the difference between governing and politics. Politics is the process of getting elected and gaining power. Governing is actually doing something once in power. Neither side has governed in about a decade, if not more. But, if getting a chubby over resisting gets you going, feel free to flick Nancy's bean as much as you like over this giant "win".

I think in the next several weeks you might see Trump get some money for Southern border security. I think some Democrats are looking for a more modern high tech solution to the Southern border problem than building a wall. The Great Wall of China didn't keep the Mongols out and the Maginot Line didn't prevent Germany from overrunning France. I think there is a feeling that a wall is an archaic solution. Trump promised his followers before the election that a wall would be built and that Mexico would pay for it. I never believed that for a minute but a lot of his followers did. The government was shut down because Trump made a promise to his base that he couldn't keep.
I agree that it's a lot about politics today rather than about governing. Whichever party isn't in power often seeks to undermine the party that is. On the night Obama was elected President the GOP leaders called a meeting to discuss how they could make sure Obama was a failure as President. They even threatened to allow the US to default on its debt. To your point the Democrats aren't playing nice with Trump either.

Neither side has compromised on anything of significance since the 1st, maybe early in the 2nd, term of W.  It's disgusting.

What's more disgusting is they've convinced our idiot population to play right along with their bullshit and continue to worry about symbolic, idiotic, non consequential "wins" such as this one while they continue to consolidate power and wealth into their coffers. Millions of people went to bed last night happy as a pig in shit that they "won" a "victory" that all but ensures maybe the ugliest 2 years of government this country will ever see.

PS- if Trump came out tomorrow with a plan that included all of these alternative methods the Dems say they want, they'd hold a press conference 10 minutes later saying they were opposed to it on moral grounds and then pretend they're suddenly fiscally responsible.

You guys act as if this  is the end-of-game score.  We're barely out of the first quarter of the Trump presidency.  Check back at the end of 2024 to see where the final tally ends up.

So, far, thru the First Quarter:
Dems block the FG of repealing ObamaCare after McCain's fumble.  3-0
Trump goes to the house with SCOTUS/Federal judges (7-3), repealing regs & the hot economy (14-3 Trump), NK talking instead of testing, NATO paying their tab, troops out of the ME & Jerusalem embassy (21-3 Trump), and TPP/IranDeal/NAFTA/Paris (28-3 Trump)
Dem scored a FG on the Wall... but Trump got "Remain In Mexico"   28-6 Trump, First Quarter.

If Trump hits the Hail Mary and denukes NK while nabbing the Heisman (Nobel), China ends the trade war by agreeing to stop stealing IP (DOW to 30k), and Trump gets real help on the border by enacting true E-Verify, it'll be a blowout by the end of the game.   Mercy clock-style.   IF RBG kicks and trump gets another SCOTUS, the Left will just take their ball and go home.

BirdWatcher wrote:You guys act as if this  is the end-of-game score.  We're barely out of the first quarter of the Trump presidency.  Check back at the end of 2024 to see where the final tally ends up.

So, far, thru the First Quarter:
Dems block the FG of repealing ObamaCare after McCain's fumble.  3-0
Trump goes to the house with SCOTUS/Federal judges (7-3), repealing regs & the hot economy (14-3 Trump), NK talking instead of testing, NATO paying their tab, troops out of the ME & Jerusalem embassy (21-3 Trump), and TPP/IranDeal/NAFTA/Paris (28-3 Trump)
Dem scored a FG on the Wall... but Trump got "Remain In Mexico"   28-6 Trump, First Quarter.

If Trump hits the Hail Mary and denukes NK while nabbing the Heisman (Nobel), China ends the trade war by agreeing to stop stealing IP (DOW to 30k), and Trump gets real help on the border by enacting true E-Verify, it'll be a blowout by the end of the game.   Mercy clock-style.   IF RBG kicks and trump gets another SCOTUS, the Left will just take their ball and go home.

I agree with some of this as Trump has done some positive things as President as BW mentions. He could get another SCOTUS appointment, likely dependent on how long Bader-Ginsburg lives. Trump has been President for 2 years and will likely be leaving in 2 years. I don't see him getting a second term. He just isn't that likeable and says a lot of things that just turn voters off, particularly women. He's in very good shape with solid Republican voters. Very few Democrats will give him a look and as of now two thirds of Independents disapprove of him. He's got a lot of work to do if he wants to earn a second term.
I wouldn't mind seeing another pro 2nd Amendment judge put on the high court though. Presently we have 4 solid pro gun rights justices and 4 anti gun justices. Roberts is the wildcard IMO.