Politics - do not open if you are tired of it

The timing of 'lost our way' seems a bit dubious considering the months of trump bashing. Biden's (and his regime) incompetence is beginning to flourish so NOW we censor that with which we disagree. Check.

Minnesota is kicking Ohio State’s ass at the half.

I think OSU might be able to get back in it. They will just have to start rowing the boat.

tps wrote:Biden's (and his regime) incompetence is beginning to flourish so NOW we censor that with which we disagree.

Welcome back, tps.....

What is “lost our way”?

I don’t know what censorship you are talking about? Has Biden done something incompetent that has not had news coverage?

I'd be curious to know what Biden has done too that's not gotten the negative news coverage it deserves. The Afghanistan situation was going to be an absolute mess regardless of who was in charge. Could it have been handled better? Of course it could have. But we've been there for 20 years. Trump supporters for 4 years trumpeted his 'bringing the troops home' and now Biden officially ends our involvement there and they are still complaining. It's just further evidence that our country is a mess, in particular our government and it's members. Our country is so horribly divided, no one can see the good in either side nor do they have any interest in compromising on anything.

Teetime wrote:Minnesota is kicking Ohio State’s ass at the half.

I think OSU might be able to get back in it. They will just have to start rowing the boat.

My daughter texted me at halftime asking me what was wrong. I told her they would come back and win which they did by scoring 35 in the second half.
Defense will have to really improve though if they want to win the National Championship.

lefty120 wrote:I'd be curious to know what Biden has done too that's not gotten the negative news coverage it deserves.  The Afghanistan situation was going to be an absolute mess regardless of who was in charge.  Could it have been handled better?  Of course it could have.  But we've been there for 20 years.  Trump supporters for 4 years trumpeted his 'bringing the troops home' and now Biden officially ends our involvement there and they are still complaining.  It's just further evidence that our country is a mess, in particular our government and it's members.  Our country is so horribly divided, no one can see the good in either side nor do they have any interest in compromising on anything.  

And if Trump withdrew from Afghanistan the Dems would be running him through the ringer.  At this point it doesn't matter what each side does the other side is going attack the other side saying what they did is wrong or they did it the wrong way.  The politics are the outcome of social media and the need for instant gratification.  We continue to take knee jerk reactions to try and solve every issue and those reactions end up creating more issues. Not to bring COVID into the discussion, but just like ISBE and the vaccine mandate for teachers and school employees. They made the decision that all school staff needs to be vaccinated for have weekly testing but they did not have a plan on the unique situations. Now the Sept 5 deadline is pushed back to Sept 20 due to a lack of testing kits and the question of how schools will enforce the mandate. I am hearing some schools basically saying unvaxed teacher can only be in their rooms and in no other areas of the school.

I compare our government to a bad school administrator.  They sit back and feel the need to change or fix something that isn't even broken so they make a decision before thinking through the entire process and identifying whether the decision will even benefit the students.

BirdWatcher wrote:

tps wrote:Biden's (and his regime) incompetence is beginning to flourish so NOW we censor that with which we disagree.

Welcome back, tps.....

Thanks. Rumors of my suspension have been greatly exaggerated.

the clown show continues
biden said
he would not leave americans behind in afghanistan - then he did. he completely f*cked up the withdrawal.

he said he would not mandate vaccines - then he did, but the USPS is exempt.
"In December, Biden said he wouldn’t mandate vaccines but that he would “encourage people to do the right thing.” His position reflected an understanding of the nation he was preparing to lead: That persuading Americans — not dictating to them on how to respond to covid-19 — was both more politically tenable and would better serve his aim of bringing the pandemic under control."
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-declares-sweeping-new-vaccine-mandate-this-is-not-about-freedom#

he said he would not politicize the DOJ - then he did (texas and georgia) 
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-violating-campaign-pledge-politicizing-doj-legal-experts-warn

I think about everyone would agree that the Afghanistan withdrawal was poorly handled. I read earlier today that there were only about 100 Americans left in Afghanistan. It’s too early to proclaim that we’re not going to get them all out.
As for his mandate that Federal employees be vaccinated I’m all for it. The more Americans that are vaccinated the better off we are as a country.

OSUBucks wrote:I think about everyone would agree that the Afghanistan withdrawal was poorly handled. I read earlier today that there were only about 100 Americans left in Afghanistan. It’s too early to proclaim that we’re not going to get them all out.
As for his mandate that Federal employees be vaccinated I’m all for it. The more Americans that are vaccinated the better off we are as a country.

1. Are you okay with not mandating USPS employees?  They are federal employees so why are they no being mandated to get vaxed?  

Answer - don't want the USPS employees quitting their jobs.  Someone needs to deliver the mail-in ballots.  

2. Why companies with over 100 employees? Where is the science in that?
Answer - it's all rhetoric and for the optics.  Businesses with 50 employees are just as suspectible to COVID as those with 1,000

3. Why was this not done 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, or 7 weeks ago?  Why now?  
Answer - we are at tht plateau of the Delta variant and the idiots in the media will say the decline is because of these measures, which we all know it is not.  These measures do next to nothing to stop the immediate spread.  

I watched the speech after I got home from practice and I am ashamed of our president.  He is so angry over this but shows little emotion over the bungled Afghanistan withdraw.  He looks like he is clueless and possibly even drunk.  He has stated several times that he is not allowed to take questions after pressers unless they are preselected.  He is the leader of the free world but is constantly being told exactly what to do.  He is a puppet and it is becoming more and more obvious every day.  

I am afraid for the direction of our country.  We are becoming more divided than ever and it is because of a virus and vaccine we are still learning about.  I know several 20-30 somethings who are wanting to have children but there are few published studies on the potential side effects on reproductive health.  Can't fault these people for being hesitant...the vaccine has not been around long enough for a full term pregnancy.

tps wrote:the clown show continues
biden said
he would not leave americans behind in afghanistan - then he did. he completely f*cked up the withdrawal.

he said he would not mandate vaccines - then he did, but the USPS is exempt.
"In December, Biden said he wouldn’t mandate vaccines but that he would “encourage people to do the right thing.” His position reflected an understanding of the nation he was preparing to lead: That persuading Americans — not dictating to them on how to respond to covid-19 — was both more politically tenable and would better serve his aim of bringing the pandemic under control."
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-declares-sweeping-new-vaccine-mandate-this-is-not-about-freedom#

he said he would not politicize the DOJ - then he did (texas and georgia) 
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-violating-campaign-pledge-politicizing-doj-legal-experts-warn

Illegal immigrants exempt from mandatory shots as well

"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

tps wrote:"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

Getting a vaccine during the worst Pandemic in over a century is hardly giving up essential liberty. We really have a bunch of whiners in this country if they think so. When the Government starts knocking on doors to confiscate our guns I’ll join the anti Government movement. I feel just as free now as I ever have. I got vaccinated, got my second vaccine six months ago and I feel great. We live in a nation with laws, you can’t do anything you want when you want. You can be arrested for speeding thru a school zone or driving intoxicated. Those laws are designed to keep the general population safe. I don’t see much difference between that and getting a vaccine during a once in a century Pandemic.

OSUBucks wrote:

tps wrote:"Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin

Getting a vaccine during the worst Pandemic in over a century is hardly giving up essential liberty. We really have a bunch of whiners in this country if they think so. When the Government starts knocking on doors to confiscate our guns I’ll join the anti Government movement. I feel just as free now as I ever have. I got vaccinated, got my second vaccine six months ago and I feel great. We live in a nation with laws, you can’t do anything you want when you want. You can be arrested for speeding thru a school zone or driving intoxicated. Those laws are designed to keep the general population safe. I don’t see much difference between that and getting a vaccine during a once in a century Pandemic.

I agree with you OSU but there are still potential issues with the vaccine that have not been proven or disproven and drawing a hard line is no way to convince non-vaxed to get vaxed.

Was a vaccine needed to end the Spanish Flu? No, they discovered how to treat the flu and the vaccine came later. But it came back in 1957 as H2N2 then again in 1968 as H3N2. Flu vaccines were not developed until 1945 and the world seemed to handle the initial outbreak without a vaccine. There needs to be more work and focus on therapeutics not just getting, or forcing, unvaxed to change their mind. Honestly, it is making them more reluctant to not get it.

I am in no way an anti-vaxer, I got it and don't regret it but I think it is terrible how people are treating the unvaxed and lumping them into a category (far right Trumpers) of which they aren't. Take a moment and listen to their reasons against it, if you disagree with them so be it. If you are vaxed and wearing a mask, it is unlikely you will get infected, at least that is what the science says.

I voted for Biden because I was insanely tired of the asshat show that was Trump and his administration. Is Biden better? I won't argue with anyone on that topic...because many things both of us say will probably be true.

Afghanistan was a joke for 20 years...Trump would have f'ed this up just as bad.

Dusty, you make great points on the vaccine...I can't speak for people in other parts of the state, but down here, we are the least vaccinated area in Illinois and our numbers are skyrocketing...I guarantee you if you ask anyone walking the streets of southern Illinois towns who aren't vaccinated, it's because 'they don't want the government telling them what to do'...it has 0 to do with any 'concerns' over what may or may not happen to them if they get it or any research they've done. Which, in my opinion, is why our country is in the position it's in...ignorance and a complete unwillingness to learn. It's no different for our politicians; no one has any desire to meet in the middle, and that's just as much Biden's party as it is Trumps.

Man, it's hard being a Social Studies teacher right now.

lefty120 wrote:I guarantee you if you ask anyone walking the streets of southern Illinois towns who aren't vaccinated, it's because 'they don't want the government telling them what to do'...it has 0 to do with any 'concerns' over what may or may not happen to them if they get it or any research they've done.

Why is that?  Who encouraged them to feel that way about receiving the vaccine?  Or about mask mandates?

Do they go 50 mph in a school zone?  Do they refuse to pay their taxes?  Do they ignore traffic signals and stop signs?  Do they not send their kids to public schools because they don't want the government teaching them or determining the curriculum?  Assuming that most of them do adhere to traffic laws and do pay their taxes and do send their kids to public schools, why, then, are they taking an anti-government stand on this issue? What is it about a virus that has caused the deaths of MILLIONS of people across the world that causes them to defy the RECOMMENDATION of their government to get vaxxed against that virus?  What percentage of those people in your part of the state work for the government?  A low one, I'm sure.  So, therefore, is the government really telling those unvaxxed folks that they must get vaxxed? No, it isn't.  Yet, they refuse to get vaxxed because they don't want the government to tell them what to do.  

Instead of refusing to do what they think the government is telling them to do but really isn't, they are following what their neighbors are telling them what to do.  They are following what Tucker Carlson is telling them what to do.  They are following what some of their pastors are telling them what to do.  They are following what some of their favorite politicians are telling them what to do.  They are lemmings and not true libertarians.  If it were not for print, electronic, and social media playing them like fiddles, I guarantee that most of those folks would not feel as they do.  

And, hey, I'm a lemming as well.  I am following what SCIENCE is telling me to do, and I am following what my conscience is telling me is my civic duty to do.

tps wrote:he said he would not politicize the DOJ - then he did (texas and georgia) 
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-violating-campaign-pledge-politicizing-doj-legal-experts-warn

I'm missing anything in this article that says Biden directed the actions of the DOJ other than a few people with that opinion. Opinions are not facts. Get a quote where a DOJ employee says "Biden directed us to do this" or just say this is an opinion piece.

It is the job of the AG to challenge State legislation that is unconstitutional. Maybe the AG is just doing his job?

ramblinman wrote:

lefty120 wrote:I guarantee you if you ask anyone walking the streets of southern Illinois towns who aren't vaccinated, it's because 'they don't want the government telling them what to do'...it has 0 to do with any 'concerns' over what may or may not happen to them if they get it or any research they've done.

Why is that?  Who encouraged them to feel that way about receiving the vaccine?  Or about mask mandates?

Do they go 50 mph in a school zone?  Do they refuse to pay their taxes?  Do they ignore traffic signals and stop signs?  Do they not send their kids to public schools because they don't want the government teaching them or determining the curriculum?  Assuming that most of them do adhere to traffic laws and do pay their taxes and do send their kids to public schools, why, then, are they taking an anti-government stand on this issue? What is it about a virus that has caused the deaths of MILLIONS of people across the world that causes them to defy the RECOMMENDATION of their government to get vaxxed against that virus?  What percentage of those people in your part of the state work for the government?  A low one, I'm sure.  So, therefore, is the government really telling those unvaxxed folks that they must get vaxxed? No, it isn't.  Yet, they refuse to get vaxxed because they don't want the government to tell them what to do.  

Instead of refusing to do what they think the government is telling them to do but really isn't, they are following what their neighbors are telling them what to do.  They are following what Tucker Carlson is telling them what to do.  They are following what some of their pastors are telling them what to do.  They are following what some of their favorite politicians are telling them what to do.  They are lemmings and not true libertarians.  If it were not for print, electronic, and social media playing them like fiddles, I guarantee that most of those folks would not feel as they do.  

And, hey, I'm a lemming as well.  I am following what SCIENCE is telling me to do, and I am following what my conscience is telling me is my civic duty to do.

I don't have answers to many of your questions unfortunately. I guess the best suggestion I could give is to move down here and live for a year. There's people who are like my wife and I who are pretty educated and grounded with what is going on, and then there's those types of people. It's incredibly head scratching sometimes...well, much of the time; and frustrating. They refuse to listen to anyone who has any type of different mind set. The numbers speak for themselves. The counties in Southern Illinois are among the highest in COVID cases in the state right now; worse on average than the collar counties even. Their ignorance is 100% why. Of the 75 football players we have, I'd be willing to bet my mortgage that less then 15 are vaccinated.

The reluctance of many to get the vaccine has everything to do with liberty. TPS even quotes Ben Franklin in his last text. I read posts on Facebook and talk to folks in rural areas. They don’t mention concerns about the safety of the vaccine, which by the way is very safe for 99% + of the population, it’s always about being told to do something. I agree with Dusty that these folks will dig in their heels even more with the mandates but most of them will never get the vaccine regardless.
I read earlier that over 80% of the population in Denmark are fully vaccinated and that all Covid restrictions have been eliminated. We will never get to 80%. The very people bitching about wearing masks and mandates are the ones responsible for why we’re still dealing with this and will be for some time. I think Biden has exhausted his patience waiting for folks to do the right thing.

OSUBucks wrote:The reluctance of many to get the vaccine has everything to do with liberty. TPS even quotes Ben Franklin in his last text. I read posts on Facebook and talk to folks in rural areas. They don’t mention concerns about the safety of the vaccine, which by the way is very safe for 99% + of the population, it’s always about being told to do something. I agree with Dusty that these folks will dig in their heels even more with the mandates but most of them will never get the vaccine regardless.
I read earlier that over 80% of the population in Denmark are fully vaccinated and that all Covid restrictions have been eliminated. We will never get to 80%. The very people bitching about wearing masks and mandates are the ones responsible for why we’re still dealing with this and will be for some time. I think Biden has exhausted his patience waiting for folks to do the right thing.

Well said OSU...I'll be shocked if we: A. aren't required to wear masks the rest of this school year, and B. don't at least start next year in them. This thing isn't going away and while I agree with Dusty in that we all have to learn to live with it, the people who are refusing to get vaccinated have an awfully big hand in keeping the virus mutating and spreading. That's a pretty tough scientific fact to dodge. We have 693 active cases in our county, only a fraction of which are in the 70+ age range and almost 1/3 are school age children...691 are people not vaccinated.

Regardless of what was/is done, I don't think we will ever get to 80%.  Right now we are at 75.4% of adult population, and 70% was Biden's goal in July.  Not sure why the 70% isn't enough anymore and why the "lucky" number has changed. Like many things, when you give the government control it is going to get screwed up and they won't give up control.  

I don't get the people who just refuse to do it because they are being told to do it, that is something I can't wrap my head around.  Also, I did not get the shot for me I got it for my newborn and the fact that I am around 400+ students on a daily basis and those 400+ students need to be in school and I saw it as a way to protect both my child and keep my students in my classroom.  When the booster becomes available I will probably do the same even though I do not believe that a vaccine is going to end the mess.  See my previous post.  

But by taking away rights to work and participate in certain areas of the economy for the unvaccinated, I completely disagree with it.  You also have people saying that if an unvaxed is in the hospital the Dr's should refuse to treat them and these are often the same people that say "healthcare is a human right." Just leave them alone, stop continuing to blame them even if they are too blame. As a coach, you may have one player who makes a mistake and loses a game for you, but you never go to the paper and blame that one player or even tell the team the reason for the loss was that one player.  How would that player respond?  Probably quit or stop trying to get better, which is not good for them or the team. Now if you are understanding and identify all of the other mistakes and do something to help that player to not make the same mistake, they won't quit.  

So basically, let people and businesses do as they choose.  You may be surprised at how quickly they change their mind and if they don't oh well. It's ultimately their decision and I believe it should remain as such. Even if it is a bad decision. Those 25% that aren't vaxed are not going to shorten or extend the pandemic in anyway, it is endemic and it is here to stay. I will say it one last time, more needs to be done on Therapeutics and identifying ways to shorten the illness rather than, "just go home for 14 days and monitor your symptoms."I am sure just as the medicines for the flu were developed some will be developed for COVID or as I like to say Influenza D.

Congress and staff are exempt from vaccine mandate.

Question - Why should anyone get Vaccinated if they have immunity from a prior Covid infection?’
Fauci — ‘I don’t have a really firm answer for you on that’

tps wrote:Congress and staff are exempt from vaccine mandate.

Practically all of them have already been vaccinated though about half of the GOP members won’t publicly admit it. They don’t want to alienate their anti vaccine supporters.