SMH...I don't get it

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SMH...I don't get it

Post by 4a(6afornet)north on Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:40 am

Just read in the paper where Morris has 18 girls in the entire basketball program.They have no freshman team this season.I don't expect that out of a school with 850 students.And maybe not in recent years,but Morris girls basketball program has been pretty successful. I guess I'm just out of touch with teens these days.I'm pretty sure that numbers are not down because these girls all have to work because their families are going through tough times.Are they just that lazy and not wanting to put the time and effort into it? I just think it's a shame and embarrassment to the school and program.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by wolverine55 on Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:48 am

We aren't quite that big but we're close to 600 and also with a pretty successful girls basketball program. I'm not sure what the total number is, but this is the first time they'll have a freshmen and JV team in at least five years.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by dusty7 on Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:00 am

Girls basketball is dying all across the country due to the influence of club volleyball and travel/year round softball. Our girls actually defeated Morris last night and I think we have a little over 20 in our program.

There are a few schools in our area that always have solid girls programs (Peotone, Seneca, Herscher to name a few) but when a school like Manteno has an outstanding volleyball program and softball program, very few girls to my knowledge plays basketball. They play in junior high but in high school they want to focus on volleyball and/or softball.

This problem isn't only with girls, I am starting to see it in Boys Basketball along with other sports. I guess kids don't see the importance of it anymore.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by tincup1215 on Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:13 am

I do feel specialization is WAY worse with HS girls than HS boys.

Club Volleyball is just an entirely different animal compared to any sort of private/club sport for Boys. Softball is a close second.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by newcom on Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:30 am

Yup Club Volleyball is KILLING Girls Basketball. We have 4 Freshmen Girls out.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by tincup1215 on Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:47 pm

newcom wrote:Yup Club Volleyball is KILLING Girls Basketball.  We have 4 Freshmen Girls out.

It’s sad, but true. If you don’t have your Vball girls playing Club, you will be so far behind everyone else.

With football, I’ve felt there’s been a very small culture shift where if you are just going to lift all year, but most of your teammates are in a winter and/or a spring sport, you can get a little ostracized by them
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by ging on Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:26 pm

ditto to the volleyball and softball reasons listed above ^
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by mc140 on Sat Nov 17, 2018 2:11 am

There are a few travel Softball teams around here make girls sign agreements they will not play any other high school sport besides softball or risk being kicked off the team and losing their money. I should also add most of these girls are paying upwards of 10k per year, to have the right to pay 40-50k a year to play D3 ball for a year or two before transferring to a state school to finish out college.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by ging on Sat Nov 17, 2018 12:51 pm

mc140 wrote: I should also add most of these girls are paying upwards of 10k per year, to have the right to pay 40-50k a year to play D3 ball for a year or two before transferring to a state school to finish out college.

this X infinity
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by center on Sat Nov 17, 2018 1:04 pm

I agree with all the posts above. We are seeing a little resurgence in girls BB around our area. But a lot of these girls are playing travel basketball.

Travel sports are head to stay for the girls. I think the schools that are still getting adequate numbers have local club teams that actually respect the sport that is in-season.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by tm on Sat Nov 17, 2018 2:46 pm

The number of people paying 10k a year for travel softball is a small % of everyone doing it. Sure, the elite level teams that travel all over the country are doing that, but not everyone.

I have managed my daughters team for 3 years. Our fees are about $800 for the year. That includes light fall schedule, winter training, and main “season” in spring/summer. Add in another couple hundred for uniforms/gear, but we don’t change uniform design, so as long as stuff fits, returning players can wear it multiple years.

Regarding other sports, I know it can vary for each team, but we encourage the girls to play other sports. I have 3 players this season that I know will miss most of winter training because they are on other winter travel teams (2 basketball and a volleyball).

This is the first year my team is 14u, which can get tricky because the age cutoff (Jan 1) makes for a split of 14 year olds in 8th and 9th grade. We only have 1 in 9th grade, and I know that she will be gone late Feb-May. There is a proposal into IHSA to change softball to a fall sport, which I think was done mainly for travel teams. I have no idea where that stands though.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by illinipete on Sat Nov 17, 2018 5:14 pm

Only the very select players pay 5-7k for vb. Those kids are usually discouraged from playing other sports during club season.
The great majority of kids are mid to low level and pay 1-3k. They are encouraged to play hs sports.

Surprising that a 3a state champion vb team has 4 starters that also play hs bb?
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by mc140 on Sat Nov 17, 2018 7:26 pm

One of the best throwers I have had just finished her vball career as a two year starter for a MAC school. She missed one club tourney for track in the three years I had her and that was so she could go to the state track meet her senior year.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by ging on Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:24 pm

"Surprising that a 3a state champion vb team has 4 starters that also play hs bb?"

Here's the thing about that as it pertains to this conversation - the girls that do that, do so on their terms. In other words, the high school basketball coach has had to arrange schedules so that it doesn't interfere with their club vball schedule. If she didn't and made the girls choose, I'm pretty sure they would choose club volleyball over high school basketball. Not that that's wrong or bad, it's just what it is. Girls basketball in Sterling is a distant third behind volleyball and softball and I don't see that changing...esp after we join the WB6 next year.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by center on Sun Nov 18, 2018 7:13 pm

ging wrote:"Surprising that a 3a state champion vb team has 4 starters that also play hs bb?"

Here's the thing about that as it pertains to this conversation  - the girls that do that, do so on their terms. In other words, the high school basketball coach has had to arrange schedules so that it doesn't interfere with their club vball schedule.  If she didn't and made the girls choose,  I'm pretty sure they would choose club volleyball over high school basketball. Not that that's wrong or bad, it's just what it is.  Girls basketball in Sterling is a distant third behind volleyball and softball and I don't see that changing...esp after we join the WB6 next year.

I agree with this about 1000 times over.

Sometimes as a coach you need to ask “what needs to be done to get the best athletes out for this sport?”

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by newcom on Mon Nov 19, 2018 10:47 am

We have some girls who the Club coach has convinced then that they are the next coming,(they are not) and went from 3 sport athletes to 1. They are also requesting to leave school school early a few days a week to make their practices in the burbs. This is not acceptable IHHO!
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by lefty120 on Mon Nov 19, 2018 12:06 pm

It's one thing to say they're 'only' paying $800 or a bit more to be a part of the team...how much are they then paying in expenses to take their kids to and from games / tournaments on the weekends? We outlawed travel baseball in our house after my oldest's first year in it...we payed $500 for his uniform, facility rentals for practice, entry fee's for tournaments etc...that all doesn't sound to bad...however, when the summer was over and we barely had enough money to get our kids school supplies, the wife and I sat down to calculate what we'd spent on 1 weekend of hotels for a travel tournament, plus the money spent on meals, gas, concessions etc for all the other tournaments we traveled to every weekend...total came to more like $3,500. And by the way, he was going to be a 4th grader that fall. No more!!

Oh, and that same kid, who hasn't played travel ball since that summer, is still going to be a strong contributor to his varsity baseball team this spring as a junior.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by Head Idiot on Mon Nov 19, 2018 12:39 pm

Travel sports is a BS racket made up by people wanting to make an extra buck of parents with too much money and too little self fulfillment.

The whole thing is set up so mommy and daddy can get another sticker to put on their SUV and prove to everyone what wonderful parents they are by "supporting" their kids every weekend by finding a new motel to get wasted in. Meanwhile, Jr grows up to be a complete mess because mom and dad never parented him and "coach" just wanted to make a few bucks and hopefully catch on "coaching" at another level.

Not a fan as you can tell.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by tm on Mon Nov 19, 2018 12:56 pm

The extra expenses can add up for some teams if needing to actually travel is an issue.

There are so many organizations/teams in the Chicago area that we could find a tournament every weekend from April through July without driving more than 30-60 minutes, or needing hotel rooms. We are planning one real travel tourney to end our season next summer. That will add 'out of pocket' expenses for everyone, but many teams with similar fees to us don't do that.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by ging on Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:58 pm

Head Idiot wrote:Travel sports is a BS racket made up by people wanting to make an extra buck of parents with too much money and too little self fulfillment.

The whole thing is set up so mommy and daddy can get another sticker to put on their SUV and prove to everyone what wonderful parents they are by "supporting" their kids every weekend by finding a new motel to get wasted in.  Meanwhile, Jr grows up to be a complete mess because mom and dad never parented him and "coach" just wanted to make a few bucks and hopefully catch on "coaching" at another level.

Not a fan as you can tell.

i don't disagree with you completely, but that's a pretty big blanket you're throwing over the entire entity.  in my opinion, travel/club sports should not exist for kids younger than high school age.  and, at that point, it should be just for those "advanced" or "elite" kids.  the trouble is, people think they (or their kids) are elite simply because that's part of the name of their team. Evil or Very Mad
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by Head Idiot on Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:58 pm

I will also add that Sullivan was the exact opposite in that their girls bball team always has high numbers a decent amount of success whereas the volleyball team hasn't won a game in 3+ years.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by Head Idiot on Mon Nov 19, 2018 3:13 pm

ging wrote:
Head Idiot wrote:Travel sports is a BS racket made up by people wanting to make an extra buck of parents with too much money and too little self fulfillment.

The whole thing is set up so mommy and daddy can get another sticker to put on their SUV and prove to everyone what wonderful parents they are by "supporting" their kids every weekend by finding a new motel to get wasted in.  Meanwhile, Jr grows up to be a complete mess because mom and dad never parented him and "coach" just wanted to make a few bucks and hopefully catch on "coaching" at another level.

Not a fan as you can tell.

i don't disagree with you completely, but that's a pretty big blanket you're throwing over the entire entity.  in my opinion, travel/club sports should not exist for kids younger than high school age.  and, at that point, it should be just for those "advanced" or "elite" kids.  the trouble is, people think they (or their kids) are elite simply because that's part of the name of their team. Evil or Very Mad
Perhaps, but I've found that's the case way more often than not.
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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by #35 on Mon Nov 19, 2018 4:34 pm

I had wondered about the situation at Morris, when I saw this Tweet from its GB HC:

"Interesting concept going on at Newark High School. Girls playing more than one sport and not specializing. Happening at Seneca and [Ottawa] Marquette also. Lots of success happening at those schools in multiple girls sports. #competitiveculture"

Softball is the odd sport out at Newark and OM; basketball at Seneca. Newark VB just won a state title, and its girls basketball program has been competitive throughout the decade.

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Re: SMH...I don't get it

Post by morrisfan on Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:00 pm

I was thinking more about this, in terms of Morris.

How are the numbers at Saratoga and Shabonna? Does it start that early? If so, then specializing in the town might be the issue. But if they have solid numbers at those programs, then maybe it is a success (or lack thereof) issue. Morris girls basketball has been real bad for a couple of years. I think they went 2 straight years with no conference wins.

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